Cynical Nation

Who said there's no racism in the UK or Europe? Cohen did his show in the US, I would guess, because he wouldn't have made half as much money if it were filmed in the UK. Taking Cohen's film as a statement on the US and its race relations generally and NOT as entertainment is kind of a little reactionary. I am curious where you got that from.

Also, the movie really did expose a boatload of racist, bigoted crap in the US, so it isn't like any of that was scripted. I mean, it really was there and those really were Americans.

As for his Golden Globe, that was a very good movie. The Golden Globes suck, in general, as the selection of Grey's Anatomy proves (oh, there's something that is ground-breaking and fresh: a TV show about doctors). But Cohen's acceptance speech was one of the funniest things I ever heard on television. It keeps popping into my mind during the day and then I laugh again. Great setup lines and great punchlines. I think the business about the air trapped between his co-star's butt cheeks went on a touch too long, but then I am not fond of fart/stink jokes. On the other hand, the setup, the kill, they were very well done, even for a fart/stink joke.

Anyway, I don't get your reaction. Did Cohen deny racism or bigotry in the UK or Europe? I don't think he's that stupid.

Next thing you know they'll be trying to tell us that there's homeless people in France.

[i]"Also, the movie really did expose a boatload of racist, bigoted crap in the US,'[/i]
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Uhhhhh, petty ethnic bigotries aren't really "crap." Everyone has them!

They're endemic to the human nature and thus the human race and I actually consider them, one of us human being's more charming features.

And actually MOST of Sasha Barron Cohen's stuff IS indeed scripted, just as scripted as those old Jerky Boys phone calls (they did both ends of most of the calls, at least after that first bunch) and Jon Stewart's show.

I'm very wary of people who claim to even aspire to be "bigotry-free."

Most of such people are naive (because many of them are just plain dumb), eager to please (because many of them tend to be unattractive) and sexually ambiguous (OK, I just threw that one in there because I ran out of actual things they tend to be), but I would add that many of the guys who pride themselves on being "anti-bigots," tend to be rather androgenous and by that I mean, not only is it often hard to tell what sex they are, but which one they want to be, but that could just be my perception that many of them tend to act a little "quiffy" and whiney.

WoW! So I guess my point is that I despise "anti-bigots," because they're the worst kind of hypocrites.

I LOVE American Renaissance primarily because it exposes much of that.

http://www.amren.com/index.html

I think Lush Pimpjaw was rattling on about how Europeans (which includes Liberal Americans) try to act holier than thou even though they are just as racist as he is, deep down.

Barry was just listening to his master again.

JMK – “And actually MOST of Sasha Barron Cohen's stuff IS indeed scripted”

Are you kidding? You think interviews like the one he had with Pat Buchanan were scripted? Have you actually WATCHED any of his stuff?

He is completely about being unscripted.

JMK – ” but I would add that many of the guys who pride themselves on being "anti-bigots," tend to be rather androgenous and by that I mean, not only is it often hard to tell what sex they are, but which one they want to be, but that could just be my perception that many of them tend to act a little "quiffy" and whiney.
WoW! So I guess my point is that I despise "anti-bigots," because they're the worst kind of hypocrites.”
I just had to ask how they’re hypocrites? All you’ve done is make what some would consider a bigoted remark about the “anti-bigots”. That doesn’t make them hypocrites, all it potentially does is prove that in this case you aren’t one.

I think I agree with you in principal, regarding the oversensitivity there is on this, however I wouldn’t “consider them, one of us human being's more charming features.” I think that statement is almost asking to bait someone.
The problem with this type of thing is that the boundaries change all the time depending who you’re with. If you have a close group of friends that isn’t easily offended and you all understand that none of you are bigoted, then you can be open and free about what you say. But when you’re in a mixed group that changes, then there’s the whole double standard around blacks using the n word. The list goes on. The problem is that the humor in all of these racial/religious/ethnic stereotypes is based on the truth in them and sometimes the exaggeration of that truth. Sometimes for whateverreason that truth hits too close to home for some and it gets taken personally.

I realize I’m oversimplifying the dynamic, but that’s the basic framework of it. It’s unfortunate that we all aren’t more enlightened and able to see past all of that and just have a laugh. Of course if we were all enlightened then there’d be no basis for the joke 

I have two seasons of D'Ali G Show on DVD - funny, but obviously much of it is scripted.

To me that's why it's so funny, it SEEMS unscripted, like some of the better interviews done by the Daily Show staff. It's really hard (and sometimes dangerous to your career) to work with kooks (and most people are kooks) without a net or script.

Pat Buchanan (PJB) has a great sense of humor is often self-deprecating, a rare trait for anyone in public (media or politics) and a truly GREAT and original thinker.

Come on!

Sasha Baron Cohen (SBC) is funny, but he's not a very deep thinker, to say the very least and that's not an insult, most of us aren't, certainly not I.

You believe that SBC has the capacity to match wits with the likes of PJB or Newt Gingrich?!

I really don't get that coming from him.

There are very few people around today who I'd consider intellectually intimidating, but those two are two are among that group, along with Antonin Scalia and Jared Taylor (American Resaissance).

As for the "anti-bigotry" thing, I'm not so much talking about the desire not to offend others, as that's a basic dynamic for most people - we'd rather not hurt other people's feelings UNLESS they engage in hurtful speech/behavior first.

No, what I was referring to was the "high-minded" sniffling disdain that some like to publically espouse for anything they see as "bigoted."

In my view, almost all of that's BS to make the person espousing that feel like a "good person."

I don't know, I never got that at all. Why should anyone really care what some of the other dopes around you think of you?

It just never made sense to me.

And by "charming," I mean natural, not nice, or charismatic in any way. I see it as a natural trait. Sure, most of the time it's raw and ugly, but most people are prone to such things as jealousy, anger and ethnic pride or the fanciful belief that "my team is the best."

Those kinds of frailties are a big part of what makes people human, in my eyes. I see them as proof of a person's "earthiness," to me.

If you really look honestly at people, most of our traits can be pretty ugly. Humans tend to be venal, petty, avaricious, tribalistic, envious, jealous, parochial and prone to vengeance or revenge when they feel slighted or taken advantage of.

I just think that's part of the human condition, rather than mere "horrible traits."

Actually, he does have the wit to match with any of the people he's interviewed. Why do you think there are only two seasons? He can't do the show anymore, because people got wise. He actually explained the interview process he used for all of his characters in a recent issue of Rolling Stone. I mean c'mon, you actually think he scripted the reaction to all 60,000 people in the stadium in Alabama?

You were fine until that last line, Barely.

NONE of the audinece reaction to these things are ever scripted.

The interviews, however, are.

I know, I was crest-fallen too when I found out the Jerky Boys did both sides of thsoe phone calls and my wife actually initally thought that some of the Daily Show interviews actually sand-bagged real people.

> NONE of the audinece reaction to these things are ever scripted.

And the Alabama audience in question quickly turned on Cohen as soon as they realized something was amiss.

Sasha Baron Cohen is a genuinely funny guy and he's come up with some really striking characters, but it's amazing to me that now he's getting credit for inventing an art form that's been in existence decades before he ever got in on it.

The Jerky Boys probably stole their act from some other "phone freakers" at the time. Andy Kaufman incorporated "real life antics" like cutting in line at stores and filming it with a hidden camera.

Over the last ten years or so, the Daily Show took that idea (phoney/staged interviews) to another level and Cohen has been a part of that wave too...but neither Jon Stewart, nor Sasha Baron Cohen "invented" this comedic art form...and it has to be well scripted because working with real people can be as unpredicatble as working with any wild animal.

There are a lot of crazy people out there and while they can be funny, interacting with them can be unpredicatble and dangerous to your career for guys like Cohen and Stewart. So they have to script most of these interviews, if only to make sure you get the best possible results.